00:00:16: Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen.

00:00:18: And hello everybody to this third edition of our little podcast Beyond Business right from ITB and the ITB Berlin Congress.

00:00:29: so we're in the midst of the first day.

00:00:31: it's very busy here around year end.

00:00:33: I'm very pleased to have Mr Camilo Navado with me.

00:00:37: mr navado he is a founder Of Wheel The World tour operator and travel company and platform For people with disabilities, welcome and thank you very much for joining us.

00:00:51: Thank you for having me here!

00:00:52: First question in these difficult days do we have a safe journey coming to Berlin?

00:00:57: I did.

00:00:58: fortunately without any travel disruption i was able get my schedule as planned.

00:01:04: so no problem at all

00:01:05: To give an introduction our audience.

00:01:08: Camilo Navarro has studied in Chile which is your home country Yes.

00:01:13: Where you completed your studies in business, economics and project evaluations later on?

00:01:19: You moved to San Francisco To study entrepreneurship and project management at the famous University of Berkeley.

00:01:27: So he really got your academic background from this famous Californian cultures.

00:01:34: I mean, Berkeley is a famous university.

00:01:36: It has this liberal tradition maybe a little leftist tradition Absolutely.

00:01:41: And then

00:01:42: on the other hand you have Stanford which also very famous University.

00:01:46: To me, it seems that the tough guys they go to Stanford like Peter Thiel and Richard Suni.

00:01:52: The hard-fought guys are more philanthropic people than soft-spoken Spiegel or then they'd go to Berkeley.

00:02:00: Yeah

00:02:00: we're more humble.

00:02:01: Is this still true?

00:02:03: I would say so.

00:02:05: Of course those are steel stereotypes.

00:02:07: but in general speaking i will argue yes, there might be a little bit Like humble.

00:02:16: Yeah, and Stanford could be a little bit more.

00:02:20: I don't want to speak bad about people at Stanford for I have friends from there.

00:02:23: so okay?

00:02:24: yeah That's

00:02:25: the company like wheel of the world you're not Palantir?

00:02:28: No,

00:02:29: no

00:02:30: And You might describe that difference between Stanford.

00:02:35: yes

00:02:36: Yes, I agree i think that they did.

00:02:39: social you know, component of Berkeley is still there.

00:02:43: And actually they're some interesting story about EDA movement the American Disability Act which essentially regulates accessibility in

00:02:52: U.S.,

00:02:52: that movements started at Berkeley.

00:02:54: so it's really an honor to be able keep pushing limits when it comes to accessibility.

00:03:01: and back-to your point I think that Berkeley definitely has like a center like core beliefs is social impact, it's an important thing.

00:03:11: Ultimately companies should be addressing important problems of society and make people's life better And we decided to pursue that path.

00:03:20: So you've got all your academic background or maybe the most important part of your academic ground You get from this Californian climate.

00:03:27: Yes I mean California so well known as a has innovative hub for all kinds of IT innovation the soul startup culture.

00:03:38: and is it really like that you could study in one of these universities for two years or so?

00:03:43: And then, You can build up a start-up.

00:03:45: Yeah Cecil yeah anywhere In any business in any corner world.

00:03:50: Yes It's pretty much like that

00:03:51: I would say.

00:03:52: so i mean...I can talk on behalf my own experience which was incredible!

00:03:57: I have nothing to complain about.

00:03:59: So..you're right there.

00:04:02: definitely an atmosphere entrepreneurship, that's the reason why California we think somehow is the largest.

00:04:08: You know it's the fifth largest economy in the world and he's not even a country right?

00:04:13: It's a state That represent his the fifth-largest economy on the planet.

00:04:18: And I think most of that is because of like The largest companies that have been created over there Like you have like the the Googles they met us.

00:04:28: Even the open AI now at the NBDS a component of encouraging people to start companies.

00:04:37: There's no fear of failing, failure is part of the journey and that really sets up like the ground for you think about.

00:04:50: well everyone likes doing something.

00:04:53: they are at least trying.

00:04:55: there is some of trying and failing it is smaller than not do anything or even try.

00:05:02: so That spirit, I think led me and my co-founder who was also living there to decide to start a company.

00:05:13: And definitely when you're around other entrepreneurs or an ecosystem of innovation in tech companies is like... ...I'm gonna just give it a try right?

00:05:24: And that's how we came with the idea.

00:05:27: starting this company.

00:05:28: Will The World?

00:05:28: So you would say in that sense it is unique, no fear of failure?

00:05:32: Absolutely.

00:05:33: It's absolutely unique I think.

00:05:35: sometimes people ask me like should i move to San Francisco right or Should I go the Bay Area?

00:05:42: This isn't my...I'm gonna steal one of the famous claims Of people at Y Combinator Like the largest startup acceleration and incubation company.

00:05:53: That says something around When You're In The Bay Area And during San Francisco, you are maximizing the opportunities of being lucky.

00:06:03: You're exposed constantly to luck.

00:06:05: I'm not trying to minimize the fact that hard working is important like make things happen.

00:06:11: it's important but there certain thing happens only their or mostly theirs.

00:06:17: That just incredible Like for example The fact can meet incredible angel investors.

00:06:25: Our first investor was someone that wrote us a check with the PowerPoint.

00:06:31: I had nothing else than a PowerPoint describing what's the problem, but guy decided to invest fifty thousand dollars.

00:06:37: and then you think about like people ask me really they didn't have any even company back them right?

00:06:43: And if somebody is willing do it You can become very lucky.

00:06:46: there are lots of people who write checks on those situations or conditions.

00:06:52: so i would say That doesn't happen in many other places.

00:06:57: However, I think that does change it.

00:06:59: I mean...I do think people are valuing every time more startups and innovation and creation of companies.

00:07:08: because remember ultimately this startup and these companies are solving problems right?

00:07:14: That's the only reason why a start-up becomes successful or grows is because its solving problem willing to pay for or someone is willing to use, right?

00:07:26: So in that regard I think all over the world like see every time more you know consciousness about.

00:07:32: we should.

00:07:33: promote more creation of company startups.

00:07:36: So starting at the Bay Area, that really takes your business idea away.

00:07:40: so it's good to hear?

00:07:41: It strongly recommended... Yes

00:07:43: I would highly recommend yeah.

00:07:45: and then you started with Wheel The World which is in some ways you've started at the midst of a COVID crisis.

00:07:53: yes And there was also very personal story about it.

00:07:59: maybe Yeah, a little inside on that.

00:08:04: The

00:08:05: story of the founding of the company?

00:08:07: I think it can tell you a bit about how we got here in first place right?

00:08:12: so my best friend and co-founder Alvaro... ...I met him when were five years old.

00:08:18: We went to elementary all way high school together.

00:08:21: When he was eighteen years old He got involved with car accident And as consequence became a wheelchair user.

00:08:27: Since then we realized world is not really designed for people with accessibility needs.

00:08:32: And of course, it was harder for him than me.

00:08:35: but we both face the lack of accessibility in general because if were together and wanted to go to a stadium or went into our restaurant or bar Or we want travel The lack of accessibility also impacted as well.

00:08:50: Of course more him then me But still Both us.

00:08:55: A few years ago We decided challenge one of most iconic places in Chile which was Patagonia, Torres del Paine and we started planning an expedition over there a wheelchair user expedition.

00:09:08: And we realized that there was no information whatsoever like... There was no info where could stay at how accessible it is going to be the trail.

00:09:16: then we needed special trekking wheelchairs.

00:09:18: That wasn't available for us.

00:09:19: We didn't know if were able to fit into hotel room.

00:09:23: None of that was available for us.

00:09:25: And we did a crowdfunding campaign to get some money, to get like the special trekking wheelchair there.

00:09:31: it was created here in France one wheeled wheelchair called Yoliet and We acquired that wheelchair and we created an online guide you know To provide all the information For future visitors to be able to repeat the trip That were going to do their in Patagonia.

00:09:49: Long story short And we became the first expedition ever to conquer Patagonia.

00:09:55: At that same time, We were planning our trip both of us... ...we went to study at Berkeley.

00:10:00: so what happened was that Our story went viral and then hundreds of people with accessibility needs start reaching out and hundreds of destinations are reaching out.

00:10:08: Hey why do you guys replicate that guide but here in our destination?

00:10:13: And we were already students In the Bay Area and while we were studying.. ..we realized that problem is just massive.

00:10:21: Another point to say why I think going into study over there is just an amazing place because not only you're studying a different academic concept, but also you have a lot of space.

00:10:33: To explore the possibility to start company.

00:10:36: we had a lot that every single homework or any group work that were doing in those classes where related two wheeled world And at that time, they didn't have even the name.

00:10:50: But we decided to explore and realized there was a massive problem you know?

00:10:56: Millions of people with accessibility needs are not traveling as they should.

00:10:59: They're having terrible experiences because of information.

00:11:03: so ultimately it led us To create Will The World... ...to make the world more accessible.

00:11:08: I mean

00:11:08: It sounds like great idea and it sounds like undiscussed niche market or maybe much more than a niche market.

00:11:14: And if I got the concept of your company right, you're working on two levels.

00:11:18: You are working on a B to C level like for people finding accessible places for people with disabilities?

00:11:25: Yes

00:11:25: Like a platform or a booking platform and search platform.

00:11:29: On the other hand we also work in B-to-B.

00:11:31: We try to advise destinations or hotels to improve.

00:11:36: yes

00:11:36: To be more accessible for disabled.

00:11:41: b to be thing.

00:11:42: how do you?

00:11:43: yeah

00:11:44: what are you doing?

00:11:45: is or what it's lacking the most.

00:11:48: Yeah,

00:11:49: not being right places for people with disability.

00:11:52: now great question and actually you pointed out in the perfect direction.

00:11:56: our company ultimately is a B to C company.

00:11:59: so we help destinations to verify market and improve their accessibility information.

00:12:06: So ultimately the B to C component is allowing, you know travelers with accessibility needs and seniors To visit those destinations on those hotels tourist activities restaurants museums etc.

00:12:18: so The thing that Is lacking the most?

00:12:22: It's Information.

00:12:23: this is an information problem.

00:12:26: Let me try to explain what I am trying to refer here.

00:12:29: people with Accessibility Needs.

00:12:31: They need very granular and specific information to understand whether or not they can visit those places in the first place.

00:12:37: So, for example a wheelchair user that doesn't know the altitude of their bed you know?

00:12:44: The height of the bed might be a blocker for them to decide to go to that hotel because they cannot transfer it right?

00:12:52: For obvious reasons yeah!

00:12:54: Exactly so.

00:12:55: they need that specific granular information I would say.

00:12:59: And this is something that I see in many desirations, in many hotels restaurants and museums.

00:13:04: That they think like oh my god!

00:13:05: I'm not gonna be too accessible... ...and at the end i always tell.. The first thing that needs to happen it's let show and display information because with that we can improve our experience and also recommend whether or not a person should come to displace.

00:13:20: so ..the things missing most are information.

00:13:23: In other words ,I would even argue if the informations were online and available, all of this information that I'm describing probably our company wouldn't exist.

00:13:33: The lack of that information you know?

00:13:35: And the fragmented information is led us to like create these companies.

00:13:40: If

00:13:40: i would be a hotel owner somewhere... ...and am asking myself why should they invest in that kind of market?

00:13:46: because it's also investment right.

00:13:48: for hotel companies To become accessible You have to invest into beds or rooms.

00:13:54: So it's also money issue.

00:13:56: Why should I do that?

00:13:57: Because maybe, yeah there has to be a rational argument... Yes

00:14:01: of course and there is!

00:14:03: Let me address first like the part where there was an investment.

00:14:06: in some cases yes but others doesn't make.

00:14:09: There are no incremental investments in terms of accessibility especially if you're at the design stage.

00:14:15: ultimately when you put a ramp instead of a stair That will cost about the same Right?

00:14:21: Like, I mean if you already have the stair and need to get their ramp.

00:14:25: Of course there's going be an incremental investment.

00:14:28: but today they're so many solutions out here like transportable ramps or... You can address that stair with maybe a metallic ramp.

00:14:38: There are always.

00:14:39: solution ultimately will open doors To one of largest underserved communities in world.

00:14:46: Today people with accessibility needs represent fifteen to twenty percent of the population in every single country.

00:14:53: And if you think somehow, this is the largest community in the world that sooner or later everyone will be part as a consequence of aging.

00:15:00: so I have bold prediction The World Will Become A Hundred Percent Accessible.

00:15:04: I don't Have Any Doubt About That Because Fundamentally Seniors and People With Accessibility Needs Will Keep Pushing For Things To Become More Accessible.

00:15:14: So you might see this as an extra investment, right?

00:15:19: You're going to have to do it anyways at some point.

00:15:20: I mean even regulations are gonna be improving over time.

00:15:23: so... At the end you'll have no other option than becoming more accessible.

00:15:27: and also.. ...you know your'e gonna open doors for these new growing segment.

00:15:31: that is by-the way spending billions of dollars in traveling like for example here our estimations according to some studies Like The Open Doors For Example study There is probably a hundred billion euros being spent by people with accessibility needs traveling, having bad experiences because of the lack of information.

00:15:53: Right?

00:15:53: Like so I could argue that if you were to improve the accessibility and display more accessible information You can attract this audience allow them have better experience expand your market as every single travel and hospitality businesses that are listening to us right now, like how many people with accessibility needs.

00:16:12: Are you looking at your facility infrastructure?

00:16:15: Like museum restaurant hotel if the answer is less than ten percent or fifteen percent.

00:16:21: You know you're missing out At the end, there's definitely an opportunity.

00:16:24: And

00:16:25: apart from the hotel industry when you would say for destination managers it is same if we look at development of destinations?

00:16:32: Is this a challenge basically?

00:16:34: Yeah!

00:16:34: It´s the same challenge because ultimately the service that were providing to those destinations ultimately receive.

00:16:41: but many of these hotels, museums and attractions.

00:16:44: So it has let's say one of our clients is New York you know or Seattle or LA.

00:16:52: the fact that they raise more accessibility information.

00:16:54: there are opening the doors for those local hotels restaurant and museum for people to go and visit them right?

00:17:00: Like so its a impact on the side of the destination But also in the site of the hotels restaurants and attractions.

00:17:07: It's a great idea from the Bay Area of California.

00:17:10: Yes, so we will hear more about it and as you said in your presentation one hour ago You said We'll all get old one day hopefully?

00:17:19: Yeah And then benefit From something like wheels and we Will take advantage Of that and might not be aware of it now right Now

00:17:27: yes but we

00:17:28: will come.

00:17:29: Mr Navarro Great having you here I

00:17:31: think

00:17:32: wonderful business Idea i'm sure we will Hear About In The upcoming year.

00:17:36: Hopefully, you're a new company and there's many things to do.

00:17:40: Great for having you here!

00:17:41: Thanks for having me as well.

00:17:44: And congrats on this amazing podcast in an amazing place.

00:17:48: I cannot believe where we are right now.

00:17:51: Maybe you can share a little bit.

00:17:52: I mean, probably everyone knows where we are right now but they love it like this is incredible!

00:17:57: We're sitting in the Volkswagen Bulli which was very old car from... I think it's nineteen sixty seven or something like that and its piece of art.

00:18:05: actually

00:18:05: It is a piece so far.

00:18:07: Its beautiful well maintained.

00:18:09: i wanna stay here if u don't mind.

00:18:13: Thank You very much

00:18:15: Bye

00:18:18: bye.