00:00:17: Hello everybody from the second day of the ITB and our fourth edition of Our Little ITB Podcasts Beyond Business.

00:00:29: We're still in hall number six, The second day seems to be busier than yesterday.

00:00:34: so we are here at Tech Hall where the tech industry is booming.

00:00:39: I'm delighted to have a guest from Calgary Canada.

00:00:42: His name Bruce Pond tip.

00:00:44: He just finished his sessions few minutes ago and as I could tell from the session, he was a man who was in high demand And people had a lot of questions and approaches to him.

00:00:55: so Mr.

00:00:57: Bruce Ponte great having you here.

00:00:59: Thank

00:00:59: you.

00:00:59: Thanks for having me Just

00:01:01: give it little introduction about your Euro founder and the owner off G adventures tour operator.

00:01:08: Yes And you found it that long time ago.

00:01:10: Thirty-five years ago, and I was a kid!

00:01:13: You're still the owner

00:01:14: of it?

00:01:14: I

00:01:15: am.

00:01:15: Founding your company is one thing but then being the owner or fit and not having sold within thirty five years to larger companies... That's even more special.

00:01:24: so he kept it.

00:01:25: Yeah, Forbes magazine did piece on me when we were twenty year old called The Founder's Dilemma about how i kept business for twenty years.

00:01:37: And that was fifty years ago now, and I'm still doing what we're doing because we are still do exciting things in innovating.

00:01:45: But you not belong to the start-up generation which is bringing up a company only for... You know how it's like that kind of generation?

00:01:54: Because after COVID, we had to terminate over two thousand employees.

00:02:00: We were startup after that.

00:02:02: When they came out of COVID You know, I felt like we were startup with thirty years experience.

00:02:07: It was a very exciting time to rebuild the company very differently after covid.

00:02:12: you know it being start up after thirty years is pretty exciting!

00:02:15: You started from scratch through covid?

00:02:17: After covid yeah i think everybody did two years of no revenue and we own many different companies but all our companies went down by almost ninety percent of our employee base.

00:02:26: So for me

00:02:26: to operate as it was back later when covid some sort point zero right?

00:02:30: Yeah And I think that the whole travel industry wanted to start up more really, because we had the opportunity.

00:02:35: To build back differently and build back better.

00:02:37: some companies took that opportunities many didn't but it was a. for us It Was A Very Exciting Time.

00:02:42: building Back After Covid With That Startup Mentality.

00:02:46: I mean

00:02:46: starting from you personally?

00:02:48: What i've read about You were born in Trinidad and Tobago.

00:02:54: Yeah From a Chinese father.

00:02:56: Yep Your mother is from Venezuela.

00:02:58: yeah Wow, you did your research.

00:03:00: Whoa!

00:03:01: I've been doing interviews for twenty-five years and no one has ever mentioned that.

00:03:06: so where'd it go?

00:03:07: Six of your family moved to Calgary Canada.

00:03:10: Oh was...I was three.

00:03:11: You were three but yeah okay.

00:03:13: And then there's a real multicultural background from scratch.

00:03:16: So

00:03:17: wow..you're going way back In

00:03:18: that sense.

00:03:19: well i'm a journalist so its my job Are

00:03:21: you sure more like private investigator.

00:03:24: That's beyond journalism.

00:03:25: So, you were predestined for the tourism industry and they're from some sort of background?

00:03:31: I

00:03:31: think i was pre-destined to be an entrepreneur.

00:03:34: Because I had three businesses before I turned sixteen —I wrote a book in twenty thirteen which is a New York Times bestseller—and it's about growing up!

00:03:42: But I started three business before I turn sixteen.

00:03:44: so... I think tourism was a passion, and wanted to do something.

00:03:50: So it went into tourism?

00:03:52: I wouldn't say that iIwas destined t be in Tourism but as destined to be an entrepreneur And innovation is at the core of my existence.

00:03:58: so all those things have been channeled into G-Adventures.

00:04:03: When I was investigating you had already noticed Talk with some people about the industry About G-adventure or environmental things And they all said, well this is a company.

00:04:15: They have good reputation and really

00:04:17: some

00:04:17: credibility.

00:04:19: I

00:04:19: like to think.

00:04:19: so work hard on that.

00:04:21: So

00:04:21: maybe you can tell us the special thing about G-Adventures or what's USB or what makes it really your company?

00:04:28: Yeah

00:04:29: The profile of them.

00:04:29: Well

00:04:30: i think we started as a company connected with people connected cultures, and that was very unique back in nineteen ninety.

00:04:38: It's revolutionary really like taking people.

00:04:41: we originally took on public transport stayed at hostels and did family homestays.

00:04:47: it was getting people connect with people.

00:04:50: but I think over time we kind of evolved into what we own which is community tourism.

00:04:56: when the entire industry going towards eco environment and connected to climate change these issues.

00:05:04: We believe that travel could be transformational for communities and marginalized communities.

00:05:09: It create wealth distribution because we're going to some of the forty poorest countries in world, bringing marginalized communities into tourism economy.

00:05:17: alleviated poverty created wealth distribution.

00:05:19: I think were first company put as a major selling feature on program connecting people to community owning concept.

00:05:27: being global leader what we do the best in the world and we continue to innovate.

00:05:35: We continually strengthen our relationships, dialogue with local communities of people... ...and bring more and more people into tourism supply chain giving marginalized community an opportunity to create cultural heritage preservation using tourism as a vehicle.

00:05:50: Great!

00:05:51: The idea is about talking about

00:05:55: customers.

00:05:58: I mean, I read an interview and then you will mention the comfort zone.

00:06:03: And

00:06:03: it's necessary to take people out of their comfort zones.

00:06:09: That sounds interesting for me because actually what is a comfort zone?

00:06:14: How do we get people out from there?

00:06:16: but why should they have to step off them?

00:06:20: Well if never leave your comfort zone... you rob yourself of the richness that travel can offer people.

00:06:28: So today, when so many tour operators are so focused on the amenities and giving people to comforts at home I think... That's wrong.

00:06:36: motivation for people to travel!

00:06:39: When you go on travel now they make sure that you could eat Italian and French food in sushi when your another country or suddenly thread counts on sheets is important.

00:06:47: just entertainment like Broadway shows or indoor ziplining or indoor surfing whatever where the destination is no longer relevant and people are no longer connected to the destination, they're instead buying amenities.

00:07:00: I think that's super dangerous.

00:07:02: first in travel if people no longer care where their going um...and there no longer connect it with a destination on why they go or purpose for travel.

00:07:10: so..that whole idea of you know what your asking leaving comfort zone.

00:07:15: when you leave your comfort zone and prepare to leave comfort to experience another culture, so you actually feel like your in Latin America when you're in Latin American.

00:07:23: You feel that you are an Africa not a Western version of... When you promise the comforts at home, you rob destination which richness and uniqueness by trying to cater to needs of westerners right?

00:07:34: And then you rob yourself.

00:07:35: the riches have full experiences.

00:07:37: travel offers.

00:07:38: Which?

00:07:38: what does travel offer?

00:07:39: it gives you capacity.

00:07:41: give better understanding where come from greater appreciation for were you came a greater understanding of your place in the world, it gives us more tolerance.

00:07:51: You know I think travel can be the fastest path to peace.

00:07:54: if more and people just understood how other cultures lived i think there'd be lots less violence in the road lot less division And travel could.

00:08:00: just all that you leave for comfort If only traveled.

00:08:04: because we want all the comforts at home Just stay home

00:08:07: But doesn't take much effort from the two operated Yes.

00:08:11: Push people out of the comfort zone, because everybody loves their own comfort zone.

00:08:15: physically emotionally mentally.

00:08:17: Well that's what has been happening in tourism and you know where People are trying to make it so people don't have to leave there conveniences.

00:08:24: So they idea is going go a country And still eat French food or Italian food or sushi Or Japanese Food You feel like you've left your comfort zones.

00:08:33: You can everything get at home Is wrong.

00:08:36: kind mentality that travel should be, you should push people to experience the local like when you're in a country.

00:08:41: You should feel like your'e not country.

00:08:43: this idea that hotels now are trying to create.

00:08:46: there's chains of hotels who promise the same experiences every country so people don't feel uncomfortable and they go into another country.

00:08:52: I just think at their should-be a tipping point where people think thats weird for...you shouldn't want to feel like you were home when youre in Indonesia or when you re in Tibet.

00:09:01: you know iconic destination in the world.

00:09:06: You should feel like your own country and that accommodations on food to represent it's such a big part of experience.

00:09:13: travel, really when push yourself out comfort zone benefits are when return home because greater appreciation for community where most comfortable better understanding were come from.

00:09:25: I've got an understanding if place in the word and thats what travels should be.

00:09:30: G-Adventure, what's the ultimate adventure I could experience as a customer?

00:09:36: Wow.

00:09:36: We have over a thousand now.

00:09:38: Eventually you can choose, doesn't

00:09:39: it give an average thing with the average customer?

00:09:43: Gosh, we've got twelve different brands of trips from Expedition into Antarctica to bike trips in Vietnam to our Nasdaq Geographic signature programs which are a thousand dollars a day luxury program but offer community experiences through The Stands.

00:09:59: So we have something for everyone.

00:10:00: We also have eighteen to thirty-something is one of our biggest brands For young people, you can take it.

00:10:04: I Have a friend actually on the trip.

00:10:06: that's taking a fifty four day trip across Africa in camping and a bus Which goes from Cape Town all the way to Nairobi?

00:10:16: We have something for everyone, but it's more the motivation and we don't define our customers through demographics.

00:10:21: We call it psychographics.

00:10:22: like there are people that want more out of their travel And they're connected by.

00:10:26: you know That purpose?

00:10:27: why?

00:10:28: They go to a certain country.

00:10:29: Why do I wanna be in my country on why they want to travel in general?

00:10:33: I've read that your so great fan off India and I mean is any other destination The ultimate destinations to step out of comfort zone?

00:10:42: Oh yeah well india is The height of everything, right?

00:10:46: Like the height of five senses.

00:10:47: I actually believe that people can go to India too soon like you should be quite experienced in travel before you go to india

00:10:53: Start from beginners.

00:10:54: Yeah

00:10:55: i think some People Go and they hate India because They went Too Soon.

00:10:57: yeah like they really didn't experience Travel.

00:11:00: first Because India is an assault on all the senses when You go there but it's one Of the few countries where It's.

00:11:06: so you know you get So absorbed In Everything the food the music the religions That culture The poverty, the extreme wealth.

00:11:14: I mean everything is such extremes in India and there's just so few countries that are like that.

00:11:20: Japan would be another one of course which is a culture with so strong food music.

00:11:24: You feel you're on an other planet when your'e here but India was one those places i love.

00:11:29: I've probably been to india over the last three or five years every time.

00:11:33: go see something new different its unique in many ways.

00:11:39: India is a very special destination when it's the right time to go in your travel career, because so you can fully absorb.

00:11:47: And I think people that won't go at their right time and they'll go multiple times after that becasue its one of those countries where you could see so many different parts of it?

00:11:54: I totally agree with that.

00:11:56: It can change your mind

00:11:58: about everything!

00:11:59: And it changing so much too...

00:12:01: So Bruce you're somebody Yuri in the industry for a very long time, thirty five years.

00:12:06: So you've seen a lot of change and see that transformation off the industry?

00:12:10: And I mean from that background of your experience what is the impact of technology or social media now we're on AI boom?

00:12:22: Is this driving us away form authentic experiences?

00:12:28: Or

00:12:28: it's also accepting to their original experience?

00:12:33: I don't think so.

00:12:34: Technology has been an amazing thing for connecting emotional, like travel.

00:12:39: and technology is the only industry where technology allowed travel to make an emotional connection with their customers.

00:12:47: If you look at what social media's done by being able tell stories that have immediate connections of customers It allowed travel to create intimate relationships with customers they never had before.

00:12:58: And so technology has always been something that in every industry, I think is devastated.

00:13:03: industries like publishing for instance if you look what it did there.

00:13:06: but with travel i think it made travel better.

00:13:09: now it did take away a lot of things and this next generation on the Instagram moments and social media as an older generation kind looks down on that.

00:13:18: But I think its emotional connection destinations into tourism And to travel in general, that social and technology has allowed us to evolve as an industry.

00:13:29: I just think it's such a positive thing that people can research, travel through social media get connected the destination before they get there.

00:13:36: now its changed the industry significantly.

00:13:38: so you have to embrace change to embrace technology because technology kind of works in parallel with business and society.

00:13:46: And so as people change and we evolve as humans, technology fills all kinds of needs.

00:13:51: And travel is this single constant that people will always want.

00:13:57: because we're born explorers like... We are born to explore and be curious.

00:14:02: Society makes us tourists along the way but underneath all of that we want to explore see the world and once you get a consciousness about the fact they were also floating in rock-in space when we shared this planet together would become curious how other people live.

00:14:16: And so travel will always be strong.

00:14:18: Even with AI, everyone's.

00:14:21: there is so much fear around the AI... ...AI will need that emotional connection and it'll never take away from human beings.

00:14:28: So travel will drive that.

00:14:31: I think we should lean into embracing technology because it only benefits us to embrace technology.

00:14:36: It changes our industry and has devastated travel.

00:14:39: If you look at even travel agents thirty years ago they used all their money on selling airline tickets Ticket bucket shops and all those are gone.

00:14:48: So it did revolutionize the industry, but made better.

00:14:50: It is stronger.

00:14:51: I mean this more connected to our customers allowed us to sell emotional experiences.

00:14:57: not everyone takes that because they've fastest growing.

00:14:59: side of the industry in last twenty years have been cruises on compound resorts.

00:15:02: But ultimately i believe there's a tipping point where people will use technology to better understand the world, but they'll need those emotional connections and travel will be that vehicle.

00:15:12: So

00:15:12: there would still be room for unexpected surprises?

00:15:18: That's

00:15:18: harder!

00:15:19: The element of surprise... Everything

00:15:21: becomes predictable

00:15:22: right?

00:15:24: Yes it takes away that There are elements where technology has changed travel.

00:15:29: The element is a very good one Because, you know as I said when we started in nineteen ninety.

00:15:34: I did my research for G-Adventures and a library.

00:15:36: i didn't Know if there was other companies doing it?

00:15:38: In the world that couldn't do a google search.

00:15:40: I Didn't have a fax machine.

00:15:41: so You know It's very different.

00:15:43: And that element of surprise with going to Africa back then If you wanted To see you know Research africa you Have to go to a library to research it.

00:15:50: today you have That information on your pocket.

00:15:51: you can read blogs you Can See live videos Of people There.

00:15:55: So that Element Surprise is gone For sure.

00:15:57: it Just Actually Makes People More Connected Though And they personally want to go to a specific country or a specific continent because it draws them and there's a purpose on why they wanna be there.

00:16:09: We can use that in the industry, just travel industry better as opposed to worrying about what we lost.

00:16:15: If did lose the element of surprise with technology how people research travel?

00:16:19: How people book travel all have been revolutionized over last twenty years but doesn't necessarily mean its bad thing.

00:16:25: cause were seeing more and more purposeful than why they want to travel, where they wanna travel and wanting it be connected with destinations which creates that richness in the experience for everyone.

00:16:35: You're also very experienced in community-based tourism.

00:16:40: And many two operators putting that on a window

00:16:43: can do

00:16:44: this kind of thing.

00:16:45: but your definition is what's community based tourism?

00:16:48: What makes difference?

00:16:50: because I mean... There's also a lot of greenwashing,

00:16:54: and it

00:16:54: comes to community-based tourism.

00:16:56: But how would you define it as?

00:16:58: Community

00:16:58: Tourism is about shared responsibility.

00:17:00: right when the group decides to go into another country You have to share their responsibilities And everyone who makes that possible for you to travel Is part of this responsibility.

00:17:11: So your putting equal responsibility on customer Which has never been done before.

00:17:15: The customer has free pass because they pay.

00:17:17: We just serve customers.

00:17:19: we believe that Traveling is privilege But there's so few people in the world that actually get to say, I want to go on holiday this year.

00:17:25: When you look at numbers of people who travel and population around it is a privilege we have to travel.

00:17:30: It isn't your right.

00:17:32: There are no rights for traveling And once they understand that That will be transformational The community brings them together with shared responsibility.

00:17:43: Everyone understands who benefits.

00:17:46: The traveler benefits for being there, the local people benefit from be there.

00:17:49: but it also around dialogue where you're actually building stories and telling stories in traditions through travel with the dialog of local communities.

00:17:59: that's the greenwashing part because people think oh we're doing this cause were are doing community.

00:18:03: But Travel For The Last Fifty Years Has Been Built In Western Countries.

00:18:06: When We Just Drop People In Foreign Countries And Local People Don't Support It Agree With Or Benefit From It.

00:18:13: That Builds Tension tourism and travelers.

00:18:16: And then so that's why suddenly we started building walls around compound resorts, they're all inclusive.

00:18:22: They tell you don't leave the walls because the natives are restless!

00:18:26: Of course there is a reason for this.

00:18:27: Because your in their consuming mass amounts of natural resources living luxury.

00:18:31: when outside those walls theres no access to education clean drinking water medical care...they use that tension to keep you on those walls ...and thats not sustainable.

00:18:41: Last question, and that's also probably a difficult one.

00:18:43: How can travel stay for the day?

00:18:46: For many people because prices have gone up in the last years.

00:18:50: Yeah And

00:18:51: as you said it is a privilege to travel.

00:18:52: at least they are affordable or

00:18:54: Well I think if we look at this statistics The number-one thing that people need too That cost of travel.

00:19:00: first of all airfares.

00:19:01: Airfares has gone down considerably over Because of choice because we have discount airlines.

00:19:07: every major airline has their own discount airline to fight the discount lines.

00:19:10: So if you actually look at The trends over the last twenty years getting places is become cheaper faster and affordable.

00:19:17: That's the number one thing We Have To Tackle now.

00:19:20: how You travel when?

00:19:23: where?

00:19:23: it's your choice.

00:19:24: We sell National Geographic signature trips that are luxury trips with expert National Geography lecturers on the cost of over a thousand dollars per day and you can travel that way, but you could also choose to travel more locally And when you travel more localy It naturally becomes more cost effective and cheaper But depends what level or what you want When You Travel.

00:19:46: So yes, travel is very expensive.

00:19:48: Yes, it actually goes up Supply chain issues with we're experiencing all over the world and there's inflation everywhere, but I'm a believer that doesn't have to be.

00:19:57: you can still go on travel independently.

00:19:58: And just go book your own hotel Go book here.

00:20:01: an Iowa stage at one of the things is really important for us.

00:20:04: at G adventures It has been a motto for us for thirty five years if you can't travel With Us travel like us and so You Can do it more affordably by you know booking local small scale locally owned accommodations, eating in locally-owned restaurants.

00:20:19: We do that for you if we want to travel with us.

00:20:21: but it's not what is happening in mainstream travel.

00:20:22: when you book a coach tour and go shopping spot they own the shopping spots like when you go off of cruise ship or you think... They give your list of places where you can shop money driven right back into the ship.

00:20:34: That industry isn't creating wealth distribution or alleviating any poverty locally.

00:20:39: So that makes things even more expensive than supply chain issues, so once you just ask the right questions do a bit of investigation.

00:20:46: there is ways you can travel and be way way more affordable.

00:20:49: it's out there but and you have to educate yourself.

00:20:53: And it doesn't take that much, just ask a few

00:20:54: questions.".

00:20:55: We're taking that as strong advice for this podcast.

00:20:57: Travel local support the local communities

00:20:59: or what's your adventures

00:21:00: by

00:21:02: one of two groups?

00:21:03: It was so great having you here.

00:21:04: Oh, it has been amazing thing.

00:21:06: on sugar grade I'm telling me under thirty five years That wasn't intense.

00:21:10: short interviews are rad but i've never said that.

00:21:12: anyone else don't say like anyone.

00:21:14: So thank you.

00:21:14: Thank You for their research.

00:21:16: That was an excellent.